TRENT WRITES: What do we do when our school is teaching evolution and our church is teaching Christianity?
For years I have heard of the struggles my friends have went through because of the school system teaching very conflicting views with the church. The reactions were as diverse as the people.
Some rejected beliefs like relativism and evolution as unbiblical, others left the church, and still others tried to mix the two through Theistic Evolution and such.
This has bothered me for years, that Christian parents don’t feel the need to address this seriously, and sometimes neither does the church (there are some great exceptions, of course).
When some of us ask about it, we often receive an answer similar to, “Just have faith.”
Now of course there are exceptions, but this kind response sends us into battle without armor. That just doesn’t sit right with me.
I’m wondering what should we do about this?
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When what your school conflicts with what the Bible says, believe the Bible: “In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth. 2 The earth was without form and void, and darkness was over the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters. And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. 4 And God saw that the light was good. And God separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And there was evening and there was morning, the first day.
Guys, God defines “day” for us in the very first verses of the Bible. Why should we doubt what God says?
The answers are many, it’s true. But I agree with Guitar with Arms. You’ll never be sorry if you look to the Bible for answers. Never ever.
It’s so important to know what we believe and why we believe it. The question is, how do we start? I would start by googling the “DEBUNKED” videos by Reasons For Hope. I think you could find them on youtube. They are fantastic, and stocked full of Biblical, sound info.
It’s true, some churches really drop the ball on this issue. So as teens, we need to stand up, educate ourselves, and not just blindly “have faith”. We need to stake everything we have, do and say on God’s word because it’s true, but we need to know why it’s true.
Hope that helps a bit 🙂
Research for yourself. Read the Bible, look up other sources, research the topic. If you hear conflicting reports on a topic, the best idea is to try to find the answer for yourself.
Honestly, we can’t expect other people to answer all the questions for us. The church will leave some unanswered, school will leave some unanswered, our parents and friends will leave some unanswered, and even our Reb DQ’s will leave some unanswered. 🙂 But that is where our own personal walk with God and quest for truth comes into play.
So what to do when school and church disagree? Well, look at the Bible for yourself. Look at both sides and weigh what they say against the Bible. There ya go!
I totally agree… read the Bible and ask the Lord for wisdom and understanding. This is a really tough topic and has been a stumbling topic for a lot of people so it is valuable to know in your heart what you believe!
Creation Ministries publish an amazing Creation Magazine that answers all sorts of questions concerning evolution, I suggest that you check it out.
Also, you mention that school and Church disagree… I am not sure if you are aware that evolutionists disagree as well. Evolution has some major flaws and so even the specialists in this area cannot come to conclusions.
I would say that maybe you could say I disagree with “this” because I believe *state your belief (respectfully).* And then research it. Read your bible or other resources and if someone asks why you believe it, you can back it up with the why!
For the bit of time I was in public school I had a really good teacher who on the one lesson (at least only one I remember!) he opened with the line that You may not agree or believe what I am going to say, and that is ok. We are just going to discuss and learn about this. (He might of said about how it was part of his job to teach it or that could have been something else…) I really appreciated that!
Like eveyone else has already said, run to the Word. It shows the heart of God. It’s totally God-breathed. It. Is. Truth.
Also, I just started Total Truth by Nancy Pearcey, and I highly recommend the first chapter to you. Hope this helps!
“Just have faith”… really this is essential for us, but I think we are ignoring the fact that when anything is against the bible we would be bothered. It’s natural. It’s work of the Holy Spirit in our lives. “So if we are not bothered with this, it means that we haven’t the Holy Spirit in our lives?”… well… maybe no. We need to search in the bible argues that says that the bible is the one truth.
We must not forget that we need to meet others religions (or the evolution, or the relativism) in view to be able to discuss with non-Christian about their faith. So then it is not always bad experience this duality between the church and the school. if correctly analyzed we can become able to take more people to Christ.
This book is amazing! =)
I’ve known Theistic Evolutionists, and my family used to say, “It doesn’t really matter, at least they’ve got salvation.” But their views are inconsistent. Suppose God created a ball of nothing that exploded, or some bacteria, or maybe apes, then let them evolve into humans on their own, following the evolution process. The ones with bad traits would die, and the ones with good traits would reproduce and die. But the Bible teaches that death didn’t come into the world until Adam sinned. Theistic evolutionists have to believe in death before man because death is an essential part of the evolution theory. The other problem with this theory is that they call the creation story an allegory. If so, a lot of other passages in the Bible must be allegories (for example: Romans 5, 1 Corinthians 15, 1Timothy 2).
As for evolution, well, there’s a lot of evidence against it if you care to look. I’ve done four Apologia science courses and they present both sides of the argument with creation usually winning. It’s biased, of course, (as the author admits), but it is an honest evaluation.
One problem with school curriculum/teachers is that they usually present evolution as a fact rather than as an unproved theory.
Science is not anti-God. At least, studying creation isn’t. Many scientists have made the modern scientific community a lot more atheistic than it used to be. But studying what God made, honestly, is a good way to find out more about Him. He created it all, after all. Just taking a science teacher’s word for it isn’t as good as actually researching yourself, whether looking up scientist’s studies and learning from them or actually becoming a scientist yourself. In some cases, it might seem that there’s a conflict between what we see in the natural world and the Bible. In these cases, (and this is where my view could get controversial) we need to reevaluate our interpretation of both the scientific evidence and the Bible. A case of an attempt to do this is theistic evolution, though I am of the opinion that that theory is inherently flawed, for the reasons that @disqus_3cFc4XVk3W:disqus said. I wouldn’t say that it would allow for, say, Romans 5 to be an allegory, as an allegory is inherently a story, and Romans 5 is not a story. But anyways, realize that it is possible for our view of the Bible to be wrong. And we shouldn’t stubbornly hold onto a view barely supported by it in the face of strong scientific evidence against it. For example, the idea of heliocentrism (the earth revolving around the sun) was strongly opposed by the Church for a long time because of a few passages talking about the Sun standing still. But in a quest to reconcile science with the Bible, don’t throw its divine inspiration out the window. There’s a line between varying interpretations and twisting Scripture, and that’s something you definitely do not want to cross. But nevertheless I am of the opinion that reevaluation of our beliefs is a valuable thing to do—it helps correct inconsistencies between what we believe and the Bible, and it helps us to know the reason why we believe what we do.
Going along with what’s already been said, know the Word. It really is so important to be rooted and grounded in the Word, study it diligently and be ready to have an answer. So many young people are leaving the faith because they’re getting all these other beliefs and views thrown at them and they have no real firm foundation in their faith or in the Word.
I also don’t think it’s wrong to stand up for your beliefs as long as you do it in a right and respectful spirit, but to do that too you have to know what and why you believe what you do. Study the Word and other Christian sources, Ken Ham is a creationists who would be worth looking into for those sorts of materials on creation and science, I personally don’t know a ton about him but my brothers have get good stuff from him so it’s a suggestion. Hope this helps!
Yeah, I’ve really enjoyed it so far. Especially how she talks about the public/private, fact/value, and secular/sacred divides.
If the Bible is the Word of God then it can’t be faulty, if any one part is not to be trusted, then the Bible as a whole is not trustworthy.
Thus, if the Bible is the inspired Word of God’s it must be taken as the author originally intended, within its proper context.
In the specific case of evolution, I can see no possibility for this to be Biblical.
1st:
To include millions of years in the genealogies of the Bible would make people way older then the Bible says they are, and if we put millions of years in place of where the 6 day creation is, then we have death and suffering before the fall, not to mention we assume morning and evening the first day, morning and evening the second day, etc… all to be a lie.
2ond:
Evolution assumes things are getting better, but Adam and Eve lived longer than we do now. Genetically speaking we are getting worse and worse.
3rd:
The Bible doesn’t say anything about or even hint at the possibility of evolution.
That ends my evolution rant.
As for relativism…
Relativism assumes, what is true for me is not true for you.(1 + 1 = 2 is true no matter who you are.)
In other words, there is no absolute truth.(This is assumed to be an absolutely true statement .)
And that ends my relativism rant.
To sum things up: The Bible must read at face value, in light of what the author originally intended.
Right on! 🙂
I know that there are those who would disagree with me but I believe that the Bible teaches a literal 6-day creation; I am a young-earth creationist and do not believe in the gap theory nor in the rotten apple theory (that there were humans before Genesis 1:1, which would require death, and therefore, sin). There are three ways to approach the big bang/evolution debate as a born-again Christian:
1. Capitulate
2. Accommodate
3. Counterattack
I choose the third.
Thanks! =) *virtual fist bump*
Well said 🙂
Schooling Background:
I was homeschooled from second to eighth grade, and I’ve been going to public high school (I’m entering into my junior year).
I believe in a literal sixth-day creation, and I in no way accept original evolution. However, I don’t want to cause division in the school and make a giant fuss about it (and if I was going to fight for a cause I probably wouldn’t do this one because I’m not a science person and never will be), so I listen to evolution as a theory, not truth (like they present it). If they’re testing me on evolution, then I’ll put down the answers that they want me to put down, but I feel like I don’t compromise my beliefs because I don’t actually believe what they’re saying.
I know that evolution is wrong. I’m not trying to compromise my beliefs in any way; God created the earth in six days using only His words. But the truth of it is that as long as Satan rules this world, there will be people who believe in it. And they’re going to try to teach it to us. Since they’re trying to teach it to us, we might as well learn it (because how can we reach people we don’t understand?)–but we also should learn how to debunk it from a Biblical perspective. I learn the things they want me to learn at school, and at church and home I learn how to combat those beliefs with my own.
Hope this helps!
I have struggled with this sort of question for a long time, and still do sometimes. Somewhere in the back of my mind, probably due to the influence of modern ideas about science and faith, I feel like I have to choose between my faith and my intellectual honesty. But I don’t. Science is ultimately humankind’s best effort to understand the physical and natural world through observation and experimentation. Faith, according to Hebrews 11, is “the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen” (ESV). Thus, science and faith really aren’t operating on the same level – one deals with the visible and tangible, and the other with the invisible and eternal.
The real problem arises when there is an issue (like evolution) that seems to impact both science and faith or, worse, make them appear incompatible. In these situations, I think it is crucial to examine the evidence carefully – separate the fact from the fiction – but, at the end of the day, leave it in God’s hands. In all honesty, I don’t know how old the earth is. I wasn’t privy to the logistics of creation. I am a mere mortal. And that’s alright. The real way I got through my struggle with reconciling science and faith was to realize my own finitude and weakness before an infinite and omnipotent creator. The scientific method has much to commend itself, but the Almighty needs no earthly commendation.
Regarding the discrepancy between what is taught in school and in church, my best advice is to think for yourself. Do not put faith in what humans say – whether they are in school or at church. We are all flawed, but God is not. Put your trust in God and his Word. Pray, seek His wisdom and guidance, but above all be humble. Through my own struggles I have learned that answers are not always readily apparent. Sometimes it is best to be content not to know the answer.
In matters like this, I find Philippians 4:4-7 particularly applicable: 4 Rejoice in the Lord always; again I will say, rejoice. 5 Let your reasonableness be known to everyone. The Lord is at hand; 6 do not be anxious about anything, but in everything by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known to God. 7 And the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus. (ESV)
I firmly believe that this should be our mentality amidst controversial issues such as evolution. Within the church, there are several schools of thought regarding this issue. Genuine believers can and do hold different opinions. We should certainly uphold our own convictions, but not let them divide us. We are all one in Christ, and in everything we should rejoice in our risen Lord. (Note: I am in no way advocating compromise. I am only addressing differences of opinion among true believers.)
Grace & Peace
This book help us to create arguments to discuss with non-Christian. I love it
When scientist came up with the big-bang theory they thought to themselves, how could a bang start off the creation of a universe if nothing caused it? They were like no! if there were a bang then there would have to be a god. In my opinion If there was a big bang then it would prove that god is real, and that he created the universe and us. The real kicker is evolution. There is NO PROOF that evolution has ever happened(hence why it’s called a theory) yet everybody assumes that it is real. It’s like saying unicorns are real just because I observed horses and narwhals, and thinking maybe they are real(sorry unicorn lovers, but they were playing and they didn’t get on Noah’s ark). If I continued then it would be considered rambling.
Good! I can’t wait to keep reading. 🙂
Lots of different ideas here…..
One thing that might help is reading the answers to the previously discussed question: “How do I think critically about every book I read”. That might offer you help on how to deal with having to hear that false teaching while still staying strong in your faith! There were a lot of good answers to that question! =)
As for what YOU can do about it, that;s between you and GOd. There is no ONE way to make a difference or fix a problem…Pray and ask God to reveal to you what He wants YOU to do. He will show you!!
One thing I do know for sure, if you are EVER asked to DO or SAY something contradictory to what you believe, be strong and do NOT fall into that temptation. If you haven’t seen the movie God’s Not Dead it’s a good one to watch!! It deals with one side of this issue….The main character has to stand up for his beliefs in a classroom even when he’s standing alone.
Personally, I would find it VERY difficult to even take a test on those teachings because I would have to write answers which I didn’t believe! I have been privileged to never have to face this situation (yet), but I think perhaps praying through and asking God (and your parents) if there is some way to avoid having to take this course or answer those questions. Maybe you can do that subject at home…Maybe you can write a research paper on why you DON’T believe evolution…idk..just thoughts…But God will help you and I’m sure your parents will as well! =)
Ultimately, how you go about handling this situation is between you and God. No one else can decide that for you or tell you what to do…But I do hope that maybe you are encouraged by the different answers given here! =)
My answer would simply be: take the kids out of public school. It’s the easiest thing to do.
As a Christian homeschooler, I haven’t really had to deal with evolutionary teaching, and I thank God for that. However, my parents have tried very hard to not only teach me what the Bible says, but also to teach me the science that goes hand-in-hand with it. There is a wonderful organization dedicated to helping Christians deal with anti-Christian thought in science, called Answers in Genesis. They seek to enable people to defend their faith reliably.
Also, I would recommend a book called “Don’t Check Your Brains at the Door” by Josh McDowell and Bob Hostetler. Believing God doesn’t mean turning off your brain, it means using the brain and reasoning skills He gave you to learn about His creation.
In the end, there are certain things we just have to believe God about, and if ever science and the Bible seem to conflict, believe the God who created science. Basically, I would say to just take whatever you learn and look at it through the lens of God’s word. To be able to do this, you must keep a close relationship with God.
Although I was homeschooled for my first few years of life, I have gone to a secular high school. My parents thought that it wasn’t there job to protect me from the world, they wanted to give me foundation (through homeschool) so that I would be equipped to fight evil when I encountered it. They felt it was wrong to shelter me. I have thanked God everyday for this decision. God has used it to shape me into the person that I am today.
Anyway, I learn evolution at school. The teacher made it clear at the beginning that she didn’t want anyone to get up and arms about how this was attacking their beliefs. I personally believe in evolution, but I believe that God created life and then guided the process of evolution. I find it hurtful when kids at my church call me stupid because of what I believe in. But sometimes I feel that people get so caught up in this that they forget that the death and resurrection of Christ is what saves us, not what we believe how the earth was created.
@Benjamin Martinson – Hey, so I read your comment and I disagree with it. This is why; while homeschooling or a private Christian school would be the easiest thing to do, it does not solve the issue, it only postpones it. Someday we are going to be adults (eek!) and we´ll have to interact in a meaningful way with the world all the while standing firm on our own convictions. Unfortunately, we don´t live in a God-fearing world and if we want to make a meaningful impact in it we will have to speak intelligently with non-believers about topics such as evolution, abortion, gay marriage, whatever. At some point we’ll have to learn about them and create our own opinion based on God´s truth and societal “facts”. Specifically, learning about evolution does not mean that it is truth, in fact it is only a man-made theory. We don´t know beyond a shadow of a doubt if a creation-day in Genesis was a literal or a metaphorical day; or if God re-made the Earth after the destruction of a previous society. The point is that what the Bible says is not exhaustive, but it´s enough to have reasoned faith. Sooner or later we have to decide.
Oh Kate I feel bad for you you just asked for a debate…. =P
Edit: I’m not gonna be the one to start it, though.
Another edit: But I will jump in if someone else does. 😉
AIG!! *virtual fist bump* =)
*warning: what I’m about to say is sarcasm, I don’t actually believe it* =)
I completely agree! We can’t know if God mean what He said in Genesis. “A day is like a thousand years”. This carries over to the whole Bible. For example, Jesus was in the tomb for three days. BUT, “A day is like a thousand years.” So, I believe that Jesus is still in the tomb and will rise from the dead in about another thousand years.
*end sarcasm* 😉
WAIT A MINUTE, you’d say, that’s utterly preposterous! The context clearly shows that Jesus was in the tomb for three literal days! The Hebrew word is “yom” which means a literal 24 day everywhere else in the Bible! It’s RIDICULOUS to believe that our Lord and Savior was in the grave for 3,000 years!!!
To which I would say, how is Genesis any different??? The word for “day” used there clearly means a literal 24 hour day! Thus, it is actually disrespectful to God’s word to say that “We don´t know beyond a shadow of a doubt if a creation-day in Genesis was a literal or a metaphorical day”. =)
Yeah, but I wasn’t going to lie to them. I knew that they were just asking the question so that if anyone disagreed with young earth creationism, they could shoot them down with their debate ammo.
It was super annoying. Do you know what theistic evolution is? I feel like ya’ll hear the word evolution, and are immediately turned off…Because I’m a pagan if I believe that God didn’t create the world in 6 days. (haha I’ve gotten that before, believe me!)
I don’t really want to debate, to be honest. I feel like its going to turn into a huge, ugly mess and people will turn it into an “us and them”. Debates like this will only divide us. And I don’t like that.
Ha! Yeah, I do sorta, I’m not sure which specific belief you hold though. Do you believe in the gap theory? Or the day age theory? =)
I enjoy debates though, as long as they stay civil – it’s good to explore other beliefs/strengthen yours. =)
Ok, I don’t think that there is a specific name for the theory that I hold..but it’s under theistic evolution. I believe that God created SOME species of animals and plants. Over time, evolution, guided by God, changed species into other different ones. A theistic evolution would agree with me on this. However, I believe that God created man in His image and not an ape that evolved into a man. A theistic evolutionist would NOT agree with me on this. That is how my view is different.
Hi Kate! =) So I’m curious, are you saying that you believe God created, say (random example) a cougar, and overtime, the species evolved into like a lion or house cat?? Like God created species, and overtime new ones are developed? Or am I not understanding…? =)
Yes! Thats exactly right! It isn’t natural selection or chance, God guided the process.
Okay! =) So then, I actually fully agree with that..!!! you’re not saying you believe in like the “Darwinism” terms of evolution just that new spcies are born! Agree 100%; besides, there’s proof of that! New dog breeds are born all the time! =) Totally understand you now! =)
I love apologetics, and though I have been homeschooled since preschool, I have run into evolutionists who basically will attack you if you try to “prove” creationism. My best advice is to know what’s out there and how to defend your faith. I did a study called “Demolishing Strongholds” done by Answers in Genesis. I loved it and I learned how to defend my faith and that the Bible is relevant to science (oh and it was hilarious to watch too!). Know how to deal with these people. The best thing you can do is plant a seed of thought, pray, and then leave them alone unless you want to deal with their calling you names and repeatedly telling you how stupid you are. For me, i just had to realize that I need to let things like this go. I am always ready to jump head on into a debate that is WAY over my head. All I can do is be a prayer warrior and hold firmly to my beliefs.
If I may, I might recommend that you explain this to people you tell that you believe in “evolution” because when I hear that word, I think monkeys and Darwin,….Maybe that’s why some people think what they do because they don’t fully understand what you mean! =) Just a thought! Maybe I’m worng though!!!
so basically time, weather, and genetics changed into variations of species?
Even a young earth creationists have to accept that MICROevolution is happening. Darwinism is the theory that MACROevolution is occuring. But regardless, evolution is happening.
Yes! But again, it isn’t natural selection (the way Darwinism works)
Yeh, I know what you mean, but I say “theistic evolution” and usually the Latin/Greek geeks out there know that theistic comes from the root word “theo” meaning God.
Ahh, ok. I’m not starting a debate, so I won’t say any more. 😉 But if there is a debate, count me in! lol
Microevolution would be better termed adaptation…sure new species of dogs come into existence. But you never see a dog turning into a cat. 😉
I love AIG, but not because they are perfect in every way, but because they see the Bible(God’s Word, written by inspired men) as the foundation of our faith. *another virtual fist bump* =D
I believe you are talking about micro evolution(or adaptation) that is to say that animals adapt to their environments by a genetic loss of information. It is not that we are getting better, but rather we are getting worse. Like wolves are ancestor to the domestic dog, but spiders don’t turn into toads or horses into dogs? Is that what you are getting at or did I read your position wrong?
I personally believe in natural selection.
*exaggerated response warning: “What are you crazy!!!”
end of exaggeration.*
No, I am not, and let me explain why:
All natural selection is, is this…
If a long haired cat and a short haired cat are put into a cold climate, the short haired cats will eventually die out, leaving only long haired cats with the long haired genes.
If you then put the long haired cats in a hot climate they will die out too.
That is all natural selection is.
agree with Josiah. It sounds like you’re talking about Genetic Mutation or Adaption, which is very different from Evolution. Am I correct?
Evolution can mean more then one thing(or nothing because it is so confusing).
1 Darwinian evolution(MACROevolution).
2 adaptation(MICROevolution).
3 change.
4 etc…
I’m in go to a public school, so I’m probably not the most reliable source. But at least in my cousin’s Christian school, they are taught about creation and evolution. From there, teachers are there to help them with their questions and give them reading suggestions, and most of the time students come to believe in creation. I think this is better, because then they better prepared to share their beliefs with solid prove because they are educated in both subjects.
Thanks Jeremy =v) I think that’s the first time that I’ve heard a variation of the invisible pink unicorn argument used AGAINST evolutionists! =v)
Yeah, thanks…I just don’t like how people take #2 and use it to support #3. =)
I never said pink. :p
Things can adapt by losing genetic information, that is what I was calling adaptation.
Things do change. A man with hair can lose his hair and change into a bald man, but that has nothing to do with #1(Darwinian evolution), but #3(change) may relate in some way to #2(adaptation), because #2(adaptation) needs #3(change) for it to work.
However #3(change) does not support #1(Darwinian evolution) even though #1(Darwinian evolution) needs #3(change) to function.
Like I said… things get really confusing when it comes to things relating to the word evolution, and I think, that is the whole point.
*head spinning* *is confused* lol, I think I get what you’re saying, though. =)
I don’t know if it’s necessarily a bad idea to answer questions about evolution. If you’re learning about it, how is it different to write about it? However, you don’t have to write it as fact. For instance, you could start your answer with something like “some scientists believe…”
My church’s motto: “in essentials, unity; in nonessentials, liberty; in all things, charity” 🙂 just thought that fit with your comment
SAME 🙂
That’s definitely a good point! =D AND a good way to go about answering the questions without indicating you beleive them!!! Thanks Leah! =)
I know I’m a little late to the party on this one.
I will say that the Church varies by denomination and by personal opinions on such issues. Do I believe in evolution as society states? NO.
As already stated, macro and micro evolution are different. I think it’s dumb to say we all came from water that was struck by lightening and that all the cells just decided to start asexual and sexual reproduction. I have also heard in a public school that the fish in the water just decided to go on land and grew legs. Clearly I cannot just decide I want to fly and grow wings. Monkeys to humans doesn’t make any more sense than chickens and dinosaurs being related.
Evolution is not foundational for scientific thought. You can be a scientist without using evolutionary theories. Christians and modern atheist scientists will always interpret evidence differently. Answers in Genesis and Institute for Creation Research are great resourses.
Lastly, there are so many other issues we should be worried about. Yes we need to take all of the Bible and believe that God made the world in the way that He did. We need to stand up for our beliefs. However, we should honestly be more worried about the hungry, homeless, sick, hurting, and those who need the Gospel. Evolution and Creationism is a great thing to research, but honestly we’ll convince people of God’s love and handywork when we fulfill the great commission.
Yeah no problem Megan 🙂
I always love reading your ideas
And I yours! =D 😉
Haha thanks 🙂
Are you on Revive?
I’m not actually… =P I went to the site and think it’s a FANTASTIC idea…However, I didn’t feel like I could make the commitment to stay involved. I have a LOT going on in my life right now, and I didn’t want to start if I couldn’t commit to it because that’s not fair to everyone else using it! =-/ I have thought about it a lot though, and if I get to a point where I can commit to it, then I will definitely join! =)
I feel ya! I just got an account last night but I’m not sure I’ll have time to keep it up once school starts. We’ll see. 🙂
It appears that we overwhelmed you over here….don’t feel like you have to answer everyone! 😉
Yeah, I was planning on not answering everyone, I didn’t want to add fuel to the flames of the young earth vs. theistic evolution debate, ya know? I just feel like this specific argument/debate is just beating a dead horse. Isn’t our faith and salvation founded in Jesus’ death and resurrection??! Not how we believe the earth was created! I just don’t think that young earth and old earth arguments define our faith…
Imo it’s extremely important. But the reason behind that might spark a debate. So, I won’t go into it. 😉
hypothetical example:
If I asked someone if they wanted to eat flour, they would most likely say, “no!”
However if I asked someone if they wanted pizza that was made from flour, they would most likely say, “yes!”
In the same sense if we remove the true context(forgetting to mention the other ingredients of the pizza) of salvation though Christ death, it undermines the would purpose of why I would want it.
In the same way, if we misinterpret the parts of the Bible(the ingredients), we may accidentally add the wrong ingredients making the Bible(the pizza) gross to the taste, and if it doesn’t become gross to you, it may become gross to your kids causing them to reject the Bible.
If this is confusing or offensive, I truly didn’t intend it to be that way, its purpose is to clarify that, imo it is important for our faith as a whole to have an accurate understanding of what the Bible means.
Is that to say that theistic evolutionist will end up in the Lake of Fire?
No, I don’t think, so…
Thanks, for hearing me out, Kate! 🙂
@Guitar with Arms : Four things
1. Ouch!! And yet, you only attacked a single phrase which was vaguely worded on purpose to avoid a flame-war about a literal 6-day vs. a methaphorical bazillion-day creation in the replies. My point with the entire comment was that everyone has to have a stance on creation/evolution, personally mine is a literal 6-day.
2. I had no idea about “yom”, thank you for defending God’s word from ignorant fools who mistakenly disrespect its message.
3. I’m much obliged to you for informing me in such a mild manner.
4. Satire is better without introduction ;D.
You could watch “God’s Not Dead.” 😊 Anymore nowadays, the church isn’t always on the right track either, so, like others are saying, use the Bible as the measuring stick for the science taught by the school and church. You’re set for life if you have a perfect measuring stick! You also have to have a close relationship with the Creator.
*blinks* *squints* *does a double take* *blushes* Whoops, it appears my second language sarcasm and my big mouth have gotten me in trouble once again. 😁😁😁 My apologies.
Yes it does! 😀
Exactly.
I find that interesting that the church would take a stand on the earth not moving around the sun, because the Bible talks about the sun being still. It seems a little far fetched. Would you be willing to bring up any evidence for the topic you’re referring to of the Christian church taking that stand?
You’re awesome Karl!
– Trent
Well said.
Exactly.
The geocentric model was widely accepted in the early 1600s, when Galileo Galilei was observing the solar system with his telescope. He soon dissented with the view that everything revolved around the earth, as the solar system clearly was revolving around the sun. Soon heliocentrism was declared heretical by the Church and Galileo was placed under house arrest for the rest of his life. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galileo_affair
This was the Catholic church, but Calvin and Luther also were proponents of geocentrism. Luther said this about Copernicus, an earlier proponent of heliocentrism: “So it goes now. Whoever wants to be clever must agree with nothing others esteem. He must do something of his own. This is what that fellow does who wishes to turn the whole of astronomy upside down. Even in these things that are thrown into disorder I believe the Holy Scriptures, for Joshua commanded the sun to stand still and not the earth.” https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicolaus_Copernicus#Controversy
Okay. So that makes sense that it was the Catholic Church and only a few Christian leaders.
Thanks man!
So what I got out of this was you just believe in Micro Evolution, cause if so I wouldn’t consider you an evolutionist? Think about it, Noah wouldn’t have been able to fit ALL the different Species on the Ark. I believe that their were like the Adam and Eve of each kind of animal, which had all the genetic code to diverge into all the species we have now. And Micro Evolution and Natural Selection (Which I do believe God has created, to keep healthy animals alive and those with disease to discontinue) would have produced the species we have today. Sorry for the lengthy post, I was just thinking about it. If this isn’t what you kinda believe I would like to learn more. 😀
For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; –
Ephesians 2:8
I am not saying that if your theology isn’t perfect you don’t go to heaven, but what I am saying is that it is important for us to know Biblical truth to be a better example to those around us. If we don’t know what truth is, how can we claim to proclaim it.
However I must ask, “Who am I to define who goes to heaven?”
“Is not God the judge and not myself?”
Yes, our salvation is founded upon God’s gift of grace to us, by the death and resurrection of Christ. I just feel like there are primary teachings in the Bible that make up our faith and this young earth vs. old earth is not one of them. YE and OE are based on personal conviction. I’m not going to argue with someone and tell them what I believe because they just don’t listen to me anymore. Anytime I try to explain my views people shut me down and say hurtful things to attack me. I don’t think I’m ready to do that all over again here on the Reb.
I not here to hurt. I am here to help. However, if I ever hurt anyone it is not my intent.
P.S.: Sorry for the late reply.
Thank you. I’m sorry that I blew up. I’m just frustrated with how the church is handling this issue and I’m kind of tired of it. You didn’t hurt me. I’m just overly defensive. I should be apologizing:)
I am a Christian and believe strongly in the Bible, all it teaches including the creation story. Just wanted to clarify. But I still find it helpful to learn about evolution. It helps me tremendously when talking to an atheist/evolutionist that I actually know what they believe. When I am learning about it in school I like to compare it to what I believe and process through what they are teaching. (it is required by law that we learn it) Try finding a Christian book about creation vs evolution so you can be more informed.
And God’s Not Dead 2!
I’ve been a fan of Ken Ham and Answers In Genesis, both help defend the faith against other philosophies and beliefs. You can read “The Lie:Evolution” it is a very good book. I recommend it.